Paul C. Buff, Inc. Technical Forum

Also the firing was not rapid, just random.

OK, were the slave eyes on or off? Did they both fire simultaneously? Were the lights plugged in to the same outlet or circuit? Was this in an older building?

This sounds like a groundign problem, but these answers will help.

Hi, slave eyes are in the default. I have never used them. They were on a separate plugs but the same breaker and the building is only 15 years old so I doubt it's a grounding problem. I haven't tested things beyond that day. They did fire together.

Perhaps not a grounding problem, but still possibly in the electrical system. Is there anything on the same circuit that is introducing line noise? UPS for a computer, A/C unit, refridgerator, anything with a motor? Might your camera also be plugged in to AC power?

There is nothing else on the circuit except the Vagabond II. I don't even use a surge protector on that circuit. It makes more sense that it's a slave issue. However, I am not sure it would account for a random fire. Would a bad contact on the CST cause repeated firing?

A bad/weak battery can cause rapid firing, but not sporadic random shots here and there. A bad connection could trigger the light. Are you using the sync cord for the transmitter? Since the slave eyes are on, we cannot determine if only one light is random firing or both, as when one fires, the other will, too.

I too have had this happen, outdoors, on Vagabond, although I can't recall the settings as I didn't think to check at the time. It has been mitigated by taping over the slave sensor but shouldn't need to be.

I'd like to also request a firmware update that defaults the photo slave to "off" when the radio slave is installed. Just common sense.

Thanks to all at PCB for the awesome products that help me earn a living doing what I love!

Ok, i got ahold of one of the new version Einsteins to test the slave eye. It has been sunny and clear for almost two weeks, until I got the unit, go figure. I did reproduce the problem indoors with the old E640, but was unable to do so with the new version, so it looks promising. One the sun comes back out, I will retest in the real world environment.

As for the slave eye being locked out automatically when inserted. It sounds like a good idea until the Cyber Commander is set to have the slave eye "on", and overrides the light, then you are back where you started anyway. Once turned off via the back panel, it will remain off until the "easy set" button is pressed, it is turned back on via back panel, or it is turned on via Cyber Commander. If the Cyber Commander is used, and set to "OFF", even if someone goes to the head and changes it, refreshing the CC will switch it back to "OFF", as it will any other setting made on the back panel.

I think the thing we have issues with is that the slave would ever be enabled when using triggers. The ABs are "smart" enough to disable the slave whenever a trigger is connected.

The various permutations you describe above, to my mind, don't excuse the default on, they indict it. When we are using CSXCVs and Cybercommanders, we should not even have to wonder if something we do will inadvertently re-enable the slave. I should NOT have to go mess with this if I refresh or otherwise use the CC. If I am controlling the light WITH the CC, why on earth would it make sense to re-enable the slave like that?

And the Easy Set button should NOT enable the slave IF a trigger receiver is connected. If none is connected, it should enable the slave. Easy.

I keep asking under what circumstance would we want to have the slave on while we are simultaneously using trigger/receivers on the Einstein? I can only imagine a fairly ludicrous corner case--in which case we would be expecting to deliberately set it that way.

So, to my mind, all of the sneak paths to having the slave enabled that you described above need to be remedied. And I suspect that a simple lockout of the slave when trigger receivers are connected would eliminate them all.


Alternatively, you could ship all Einsteins with moon-unit-bag-pink duct tape so we can default the slave eyes ourselves.... (Seriously, it is not going to be a good word of mouth promotion when other photographers see our Einsteins, check em out, and then have to ask "What's this piece of tape for?"

Alien Bees only locked out the slave eye if something was plugged into the sync jack. Using the RJ11 jack alone did not lock out the slave eye.

As for using two together,

1) Say a shooter wanted to be able to adjust the flashes, but keep a speed lite in the hotshoe (and did not/could not connect via PC cord). The speedlite could trigger the lights. At lowered power, the Einsteins could recycle fast enough that preflashes were not a concern. Alternatively, some modern flashes and most older flashes had an auto sensing eye, so it could operate automatically with no preflash.

2) Radio is not suitable for all locations. Underwater photogs cannot use radio from underwater to trigger above water flashes. They (or an assistant) could use a CC to adjust lights, but use an on camera flash to trigger the lights.

3) Range may be an issue for radio when optical slaves are not. A photographer may be able to get close enough to adjust lights via CC, but that may not be a good shooting position. A closer flash could potentially trigger an optical slave at ranges not possibel by radio, particularly if there is interference. There is a train photographer in mind that could potentially use this if the need arose.

4) similar to 2 & 3, bending around attenuating obsticles. Metal buildings, adobe walls (yes, I have spoken to those who do this), etc, will reduce or eliminate radio range. It may be easier to get to some spots for adjustment vs. the unit itself, but light can bounce around better than radio waves.

5) redundancy in triggering, see: http://strobist.blogspot.com/2008/06/on ... -pt-1.html

While these examples may be on the fringes, I have had to help find a solution to every one of them, and I am sure more are out there. If we decided the slave eye could not be used under any circumstance with a tranciever, this would add more cost to the solution, if one could be found.

As for word of mouth, we have access to a wide variety of strobes spanning a wide range of brand, cost, quality and age that have manual switches for the slave eye. I cannot see why a light would have a switch if it automatically disengaged when connected to a sync cord. With that and the new power supply not triggering in direct sun, these units are on about the same playing field as ours (for this particular function), in that you will have to manually turn off the slave eye.

That said, I pass all suggestions along and, as you know, Paul reads these posts as well.