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Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
http://www.paulcbuff-techforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=646		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  nc_mike [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:53 am ]
Post subject:  Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
I own 2 B800’s and 5 Photogenic PL1250 DR powerlights. I’ve been anticipating the Einstein line for a long time and ready to place my (back) order – I don’t mind waiting as I know from my B800 and VII purchase that I’ll almost certainly be delighted when I receive my order – PCB completely dispelled my initial misconceptions before I owned my PCB gear – but I’ve been loath to give up my digital PLs in the studio with remote control – even if basic by comparison to the new Einstein+CyberCommander combo. I didn’t jump immediately to place an order earlier this year– I prefer to give a product a few months to shake out initial issues and it looks like PCB is there now with several firmware updates and such.

I’ve scanned a few dozen pages of forum posts but haven’t found any scenarios how to typically use the Einsteins+CyberCommander combination in the studio for metering portraits. I am no expert – so forgive me if this is basic noob stuff.

Let’s assume I have 3 Einstein E640 lights, each with a CSCXV transceiver module and a CyberCommander remote control unit. With my traditional flash meter I turn off all but one flash but my main, position the light and take an incident meter reading from the subjects face pointing the meter towards my camera to get my first light reading. I repeat the same with the fill and hair lights. I then turn on all three units and take an overall incident reading from the subject to get a final exposure reading. I measure each flash unit independently to set my lighting ratio.

Now lets assume I just receive my brand new Einstein combination. As I have read, the CyberCommander is a digital incident meter that automatically communicates with the digital heads and can sit on my DSLRs hot shoe most of the time. When it comes time to meter my first session, what is the basic scenario? After I power up the heads I assume I need to take the CyberCommander in hand and go to my subject location to take reference incident meter readings from the subject towards the camera the way I’ve always done it. Key questions – do I need measure each flash head and turn the others off when taking my initial readings or do I just turn on all three, take a reading of all three at once by pointing the CyberCommander toward the camera from my subject’s face and the CyberCommander just tells me what the f-stop is of each unit plus the overall f-stop of all three together? If so, then do I just use the CyberCommander display to adjust the f-stop of each light to achieve the ratios I want?

I understand that once I have my desired setting I can simply increase or decrease the overall f-stop of all lights in unison from the CyberCommander - as well as memorize the setup and recall any of multiple setups – nice.

I apologize for the basic questions but nowhere have I read a complete scenario documented for noob.

Regards,
Mike
Author:  BigIronCruiser [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
1. If your budget allows, life is easier if you have a CC and a CST; the CC would stay in your hand, and the CST would stay in the hotshoe.

2. You would set a unique "channel" for each of your three CSXCV's. The E640's would be powered up, and you would then use the CC to "find" (takes 5-10 seconds) the three strobes. Since you've got a CSXCV in each strobe, you would want to ensure that auto-trigger is set to "Off" for each light. This is a parameter setting on the CC, and it only takes a few seconds to make the change. Each E640 can be triggered and metered independently from the CC by selecting its channel, so there's no need to turn lights off while metering unless you forget to disable the auto-trigger. The lights can also be fired and metered as a group from the CC. In summary, ration and power settings would be done similar to the way you do it now, except it's all done remotely using the CC.

FYI - If you dig around in this forum, you will see that there is still an unresolved CC issues. Primarily, some people have been having trouble getting the CC to communicate with Einsteins when certain light modifiers are in place. In my case, the CC stops talking to the Einstein after 10-15 feet if a beauty dish is mounted. This isn't a show-stopper, but it's worth knowing. I believe PCB and his folks are still beavering away to get this resolved.
Author:  nc_mike [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
OK, sounds like a nice setup. So once I do that all I need to do is pick the channel for the selected strobe and I can dial in the f-stop I want and the CC will automatically set the power of the monolight to the right level to get that incident reading?

You also mentioned the problem with the remote being reliable on a receiver with a beauty dish. Is that problem specific to just the beauty dish or to softboxes as well? I didn't think these units required line of sight to function or is it the metal that is the issue? (I am working in a 20x20 shooting space BTW so I am typically within ~15 feet of all the light heads).

Regards,
Mike
Author:  BigIronCruiser [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
You can change power settings with the CC, but there are many variables that prevent you from simply dialing in a desired f-stop and then expecting it to be dead-on-the-money. In my experience, it takes several iterations of power-adjustments & readings.

I've only seen the CC reliability issue when using a beauty dish, but YMMV.
Author:  Luap [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
We have tracked down the CC range problems to the antenna foil sometimes touching the can that shields the actual transceiver required by the FCC. This has been corrected in production and any users suffering very short range should contact us for replacement. We are also doing improvements to the antenna tuning to further increase the range.

I tested a current version Einstein/CC yesterday and got about 170' line of sight control and firing, and about 50' indoors firing through two or three walls. Firing Einstein from the CST yielded about 250' line of sight. We are continuing to improve the range for future releases.

As for setting camera exposure for each light via CC, you first guestimate the power desired from each light, then meter with CC. After you meter, you simply raise or lower each light to the exact f stop desired. This process is quite accurate unless you are making adjustments of five or more f stops, in which case you may see an error on the order of 1/4 f or so. This is about the only case where re-metering might be desirable.

Once you have setup all the lights, you can meter the aggregate of ALL lights. If you end up with, say, f11 + 9/10 but you want to shoot at f8, you simply click down the ALL Lights screen down to f8 and you're ready to go. If you then went back to look at the f output of each individual light you would see they have each be dropped by 1.9f in this example, and this will show up on the display without the need to re-meter.
Author:  BigIronCruiser [ Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
Luap wrote:
We have tracked down the CC range problems to the antenna foil sometimes touching the can that shields the actual transceiver required by the FCC. This has been corrected in production and any users suffering very short range should contact us for replacement. We are also doing improvements to the antenna tuning to further increase the range.

Paul,

It appears that part of the range problem has been solved by correcting the issue with the foil touching the can, but you indicate in the same post that "we are also doing improvements" in antenna tuning. This gives me the feeling that the antenna tuning remains a work in progress. In another thread titled "CC + CSXCV + Einstein = Poor Range and Reliability", you stated that "Several mods are going in Einsteins now shipping".

1) How (assuming they do) do these Einstein "mods" relate to the CC/Einstein range issue?
2) Is the CC antenna tuning a completed task, or is it a work in progress?
3) Bottom line: for those of us experiencing CC range issues with Einsteins, would we be better off waiting a few weeks while you continue to get this nailed down?
Author:  Liquid Rhino [ Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
Thanks for the update Paul! :)
Author:  GHP [ Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
I'm having the some very short ranges both for triggering and for adjusting power with a CC Einstein setup. I did a shoot the other night with 4 Einsteins and a Zeus and had to walk within 15' of the lights to get the power to update. It's taken me a while to notice as I typically shoot with a CST on the camera and the CC in my pocket (dying for a lanyard strap BTW) unless I have two bodies on the go. I had a long lens on one body with the CST and a med zoom on the other with the CC and it just wouldn't trigger the background lights (about 30' away).

I'll call customer service tomorrow and see what we can work out.
Author:  Luap [ Mon Jul 05, 2010 8:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Einstein+CyberCommander - Portrait Meetering Scenario
By all means call customer service. We had some CCs with a circuit board flaw that allowed the metal FCC shield to touch the antenna connection during shipment. This causes exactly what you are seeing . . . very short range. A phone call will get it taken care. Still, in my opinion, it's worth the extra $59.95 to put a CST on each camera.

As for setting up for a portrait session, here's what I would do:

1. Set the Einsteins so the model lamp tracks the flash.

2. Adjust them by eye for what you think you want on your shot.

3 Set to ALL, and meter. If you get f11 + 8/10 but want to shoot at f8, just click down (bracket) so the meter reads f8. This will reduce each separate light by 1-8/10f.

If you want to see the f output of each light for a specific ratio, no need to turn lights off and on . . . just select the main light and press meter. This will meter the main light only, then do the same with each other light. After metering individual lights you can then raise or lower each to the exact f stop you want from each light without re metering. If you do this, you will alter the overall exposure, so the last step should be to meter ALL once more to get the exact camera exposure you want. Then save this as a preset and you can come back to it whenever you want.

Particularly useful for say doing a group of seniors, etc. You can set up presets for high key, low key, etc and recall any of them instantly.
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